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News | National Core Competence Benchmark (NCCB)

Minutes From The Last Committee Meeting

Posted on April 22, 2013 by khuiejknec

Minutes of the meeting held on Thursday 7 March 2013


Errol Taylor (Chair) RoSPA – Royal Society for the Prevention of Accidents
Paul Hardwicke Human Focus (on behalf of Ian Pemberton)
Lech Kluk AITT – Association of Industrial Truck Trainers
Russell Mott B&ES – Building and Engineering Services
Lee Witton-Brown LEEA – Lifting Equipment Engineers Association
Chris Wraith IPAF – International Powered Access Federation (on behalf of Tim Whiteman)
Andrew Wright LEEA – Lifting Equipment Engineers Association
Louise Collins RoSPA – Minutes Secretary

Apologies: Graham ArundellHAE – Hire Association EuropePeter BennettPASMA – Prefabricated Access Suppliers & Manufacturers AssociationRichard HulmesSAFed – Safety Assessment FederationMartin MurdochPSE – Portable Sanitation EuropeIan PembertonHuman FocusPaul ReeveECA/SGUK – Electrical Contractors Association/Safety GroupsPaul RichardsInterserveRob VondyHSE – Health & Safety ExecutiveTim WhitemanIPAF – International Powered Access Federation  Absent: Paul BeaumontUKATA – UK Asbestos Training AssociationAndy PuttockCSCS – Construction Skills Certification SchemeSteven ProudfootAsset SkillsPete WalkerBCSA – British Constructional Steelwork Association

1. Welcome and Apologies

Errol Taylor opened the meeting and thanked LEEA for hosting.  Apologies were read out and noted as listed above.  Russell Mott understood that Paul Beaumont might have moved on from UKATA and would look into this further and report back to Louise Collins.  Paul Hardwicke was running late due to travel problems and therefore the Agenda was moved around to accommodate this.

2. Minutes of previous meeting

The minutes of the meeting held on 18 October 2012 were APPROVED as a true and accurate record of the meeting.

3. Matters Arising

All actions from the previous meeting held on 18 October 2012 were complete with the exception of point 5.  It was AGREED that this should be completed as soon as possible and would be discussed further at point 7 of this meeting’s Agenda.

Action from 18th October 2012: Following a lengthy discussion it was AGREED that Mr Pemberton would draft a letter to OSH course providers on behalf of RoSPA/NCCB to encourage completion of the NCCB application form and add their courses to the NCCB.  Richard Hulmes AGREED to forward contact details for his contact at EAL.  Lech Kluk AGREED to forward contact details for his contact at Mines Rescue Service and Errol Taylor would contact City & Guilds.

Errol Taylor confirmed that the Press Release promoting the work of the NCCB had been issued in October 2012 but despite some take up by the trade press, RoSPA hadn’t received any fresh enquiries and it was agreed to check whether Human Focus had picked up any change in the number of visits to the NCCB website..

4. Any Other Business

Forklift Accrediting Bodies Association (ABA) – Lech Kluk

Lech Kluk explained the background of the ABA which had originally been formed a year ago by six forklift accrediting bodies; AITT (Association of Industrial Truck Trainers), RTITB, ITSSAR (Independent Standards Scheme and Register) and NPORS (National Plant Operators Registration Scheme), CSKills (also known as CITB Construction Industry Training Board) and Lantra.  CSKills and Lantra had since withdrawn and the four remaining bodies have continued.

Lech informed the Committee that the Approved Code of Practice – L117 was due to be published four days ago and a press release was imminent. HSE had passed the scheme on 20 February 2013 and had agreed to add it to its website although they would not rubber-stamp it.  There was no membership fee to join the scheme and any accrediting body was welcome to apply to join.

The next meeting of the ABA was due to be held in June 2013 with the auditors being appointed following that meeting. Lech asked NCCB committee members to forward any recommendations to him.

Lech encouraged the committee to visit the website  HYPERLINK “http://www.abawt.co.uk” www.abawt.co.uk for further information.

Paul Hardwicke joined the meeting at 11.35am

Big Book of Accident Prevention (BBAP) – Errol Taylor

Errol circulated a copy of the BBAP ( HYPERLINK “http://www.rospa.com/bigbook.pdf” www.rospa.com/bigbook.pdf) and agreed to post hard copies to all. RoSPA had drafted BBAP to raise awareness of the scale of unintentional injury within the world of Public Health, at a time of considerable change within the English healthcare system. BBAP has generally been very well received although members of RoSPA’s National Occupational Safety & Health Committee had expressed concerns that an implied

5. Review of current course listings

Paul Hardwicke confirmed that Lyon Work & Rescue had been approved by RoSPA and Errol Taylor agreed to check this.  There were no other courses contested.

6. Update on requests to add new courses since the last meeting

Joint Approvals Unit for Periodic Training (JAUPT) had approached Human Focus to be added to the NCCB database.  Chris Wraith was aware of JAUPT and the meeting unanimously AGREED to add JAUPT to the database.

Paul Hardwicke had received a note from Nick Choi at NEBOSH explaining that one credit on NCF relates to 10 hours learning.  NCCB’s current formula does not calculate in the same way and therefore may not be consistent.  Following a lengthy discussion the points below were highlighted:

The current NCCB formula, administered by Human Focus, equates half a day of training to one NCF credit and one full day equates to 2-5 NCF credits. This means that entry level courses are usually equal to one credit while typical level 3 courses with 120 hours learning equate to 30 credits.

More clarity was needed around shorter courses such as entry levels and levels one and two..

Concerns were raised around the credits being built on hours of learning rather than the course content.

There were currently approximately 480 courses on the NCCB database with nine levels.  To help the NCCB understand the scale of the potential challenge, Paul Hardwicke agreed to investigate how many courses were in each level and report back to the Committee before the next meeting.

Paul Hardwicke would produce a spreadsheet with details of all Level 2 courses in the first instance and would circulate for discussion before the next meeting.

After some discussion it was agreed that all Fire Brigade courses would be listed under one single banner of ‘Fire Brigade’

7. Membership

Christine Winter, the Chairperson of Independent Asbestos Training Providers (IATP) had contacted Paul Hardwicke with a request to join the NCCB.  After discussions around potential conflict of interest it was AGREED that IATP should be invited to attend the next NCCB in October to present their courses and a decision would be made at that meeting.  In the meantime it was AGREED that we ask Rob Vondy to liaise with his colleagues at HSE for further background information on IATP.

A discussion around the current process took place where it was agreed that trade courses were better known and that the NCCB had not scratched the surface with bodies such as City & Guilds.  Errol Taylor agreed to write to the organisations as agreed at the previous meeting on behalf of NCCB and would keep the Committee updated of progress.

8. Marketing/Promotion of NCCB

The new NCCB website is now live.  Paul Hardwicke commented that there had not been a spike in website traffic or enquiries since the October 2012 press release but he’d liaise with Ian Pemberton for more detailed statistics before the next meeting.  It was AGREED that the press release would be re-issued and added to all Committee members’ websites with a few minor alterations.

9. Costs, Budget & Fundraising

Errol Taylor thanked the members for all giving their time and expertise at this meeting. In particular, Errol thanked LEEA’s Lee Witton-Brown and Andrew Wright for hosting this meeting and Human Focus’s Paul Hardwicke and Ian Pemberton for their work in hosting the NCCB website.

Paul Hardwicke stated that he felt that the NCCB needed funds to raise awareness among course providers, employers and employees.

Errol asked the members for their thoughts on the following questions:

What are our ambitions?

What benefits are the committee members getting?

What benefits are the businesses getting who join?

Paul Hardwicke agreed to look into the links people had clicked on and if possible which purchases they had made through the website.  Paul continued to say that the cost of hosting the website at this stage is relatively small as it was just general admin costs and tweaks to the website.  However, if Human Focus were to be paid for their work on the website then Lech Kluk suggested that the NCCB might need its own bank account. It was AGREED to add this item to the next Agenda.

10. Any other business continued

Russell Mott would like to see the NCCB promoting more awareness on asbestos, in a similar way to UKATA.

11. Date of next meeting

It was AGREED that Louise Collins would circulate potential dates for the next meeting. Venue to be either RoSPA HQ, Edgbaston or BDO HQ, London.